{"id":3054,"date":"2007-08-16T12:24:14","date_gmt":"2007-08-16T10:24:14","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/aomoi.net\/blog\/arkiv\/854"},"modified":"2012-02-13T11:30:26","modified_gmt":"2012-02-13T10:30:26","slug":"sv%c3%a6rt-restriktivt-syn-pa-pavens-motu-proprio-fra-skottland","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/aomoi.net\/blogg\/2007\/08\/sv%c3%a6rt-restriktivt-syn-pa-pavens-motu-proprio-fra-skottland\/","title":{"rendered":"Sv\u00e6rt restriktivt syn p\u00e5 pavens motu proprio fra Skottland"},"content":{"rendered":"<p>Jeg leser stadig kommentarene\/ retningslinjene til pavens dokument om den gamle liturgien, mest p\u00e5 bloggen <a href=\"http:\/\/wdtprs.com\/blog\/\">WDTPRS<\/a>. I dag sier Father Z. at han aldri lest et s\u00e5 negativt og restriktivt dokument som det erkebiskopen i Glasgow er i ferd med \u00e5 sende ut. Det ser ut til at ingen prester ordinert etter 1970 vil f\u00e5 lov til \u00e5 bruke den gamle messen, og bare troende som over lang tid har brukt den gamle liturgien, skal f\u00e5 lov til \u00e5 fortsette med det! Var det dette pave Benedikt hadde i tankene? Her er noe av dokumentet med Father Z&#8217;s kritiske kommentarer:<\/p>\n<p><i><font color=\"#333399\">&laquo;Notice that there is to be a &laquo;stable group&raquo;, a single request does not establish such a group. Moreover the group is to be identified as adhering to the earlier liturgical rite. A vague hankering for the old days is not an adherence to the earlier rite; this document has been issued to attempt to address serious divisions, not a generalised longing for days past. The word &laquo;adhere&raquo; is fundamental to the use of the extraordinary form. I find it difficult to envisage that there are any &laquo;stable groups&raquo; in our diocese who &laquo;adhere&raquo; to the 1962 Missal.<\/font>  <font color=\"#FF0000\">[How many mistakes can we find in this?  1) &laquo;stable group&raquo; is not in the document, 2) &laquo;attached&raquo; not &laquo;adhere&raquo;, 3) the M.P. says &laquo;attached to the previous liturgical tradition&raquo; not &laquo;1962 Missal&raquo;]<\/font> <font color=\"#333399\">There are clearly individuals who do so, but when offered a weekly celebration  of Mass in the 1962 Missal less than 30 people regularly attend. Furthermore it is difficult to say that people who do not regularly attend the 1962 Missal when it is actually available &laquo;adhere&raquo; to this Rite.&raquo;<\/p>\n<p>&laquo;Priests ordained after 1970 are unlikely to be qualified to celebrate the Mass according to the 1962 ritual. It is certainly clear that a one week course would be insufficient to so qualify a priest. The discernment is mine &#8230;<\/font> <font color=\"#FF0000\">[Nope, again.   The discernment is the Church\u2019s law and practice.  Idoneus means a minimum qualification.  A priest ought to be able to pronounce the words and know the rubrics.  That is it.]<\/font> <font color=\"#333399\">As the chief liturgist of our diocesan community I expect to be consulted so that I may confirm that any particular priest, before he begins to do so, is &laquo;qualified&raquo; to celebrate the extraordinary form in parishes.&raquo;<\/font>  <font color=\"#FF0000\">[My heavens.  I am left amazed.]<\/font><\/p>\n<p><\/i><!--more--><i><font color=\"#333399\">&laquo;Article 9 refers to the permission granted to parish priests to use the earlier Ritual for four of the sacraments\u2026it is to be noted that this article falls under the same requirements that there be a stable group with an attachment to the prior rite, <\/font><font color=\"#FF0000\">[NO IT DOESN\u2019T. Art. 9, \u00a7 1: &laquo;Similarly, a pastor, [PASTOR  PASTOR] everything having been well though out, can grant permission for using the older Ritual administrate of  the sacraments of Baptism, Matrimony, Penance and Annointing of the Sick, as the good of souls suggests.&raquo; This says NOTHING about any &laquo;stable group&raquo; or even the group referred to as coetus \u2026 continenter exsistit.]<\/font><font color=\"#333399\"> that the ordinary form is not displaced and that the priest be suitable qualified&#8230;.I require that you consult me before making use of these rites so that I may verify the circumstances for the use of the earlier Ritual and your suitability for its use&raquo;.<\/p>\n<p>&laquo;&#8230;no-one may be forced <\/font><font color=\"#FF0000\">[GOOD GRIEF!]<\/font> <font color=\"#333399\">to take part in the 1962 rituals when they would wish to celebrate according to the ordinary Rite&raquo;.<\/p>\n<p>&laquo;I look to you, the priests of the diocese to cooperate with me<\/font> <font color=\"#FF0000\">[OR ELSE]<\/font><font color=\"#333399\"> in this matter so that all may be done in the spirit of <\/font><font color=\"#FF0000\">[repression]<\/font> <font color=\"#333399\">unity that the Holy Father so urgently<\/font> <font color=\"#FF0000\">[tried to avoid]<\/font> <font color=\"#333399\">seeks.<\/font>&laquo;<\/i><\/p>\n<p><a href=\"http:\/\/wdtprs.com\/blog\/2007\/08\/glaswegian-archbishops-hostility-toward-the-motu-proprio\/\">LES MER HER<\/a>.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Jeg leser stadig kommentarene\/ retningslinjene til pavens dokument om den gamle liturgien, mest p\u00e5 bloggen WDTPRS. I dag sier Father Z. at han aldri lest et s\u00e5 negativt og restriktivt dokument som det erkebiskopen i Glasgow er i ferd med \u00e5 sende ut. Det ser ut til at ingen prester ordinert etter 1970 vil f\u00e5 [&hellip;]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":2,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"site-sidebar-layout":"default","site-content-layout":"","ast-site-content-layout":"default","site-content-style":"default","site-sidebar-style":"default","ast-global-header-display":"","ast-banner-title-visibility":"","ast-main-header-display":"","ast-hfb-above-header-display":"","ast-hfb-below-header-display":"","ast-hfb-mobile-header-display":"","site-post-title":"","ast-breadcrumbs-content":"","ast-featured-img":"","footer-sml-layout":"","ast-disable-related-posts":"","theme-transparent-header-meta":"","adv-header-id-meta":"","stick-header-meta":"","header-above-stick-meta":"","header-main-stick-meta":"","header-below-stick-meta":"","astra-migrate-meta-layouts":"default","ast-page-background-enabled":"default","ast-page-background-meta":{"desktop":{"background-color":"var(--ast-global-color-5)","background-image":"","background-repeat":"repeat","background-position":"center center","background-size":"auto","background-attachment":"scroll","background-type":"","background-media":"","overlay-type":"","overlay-color":"","overlay-opacity":"","overlay-gradient":""},"tablet":{"background-color":"","background-image":"","background-repeat":"repeat","background-position":"center center","background-size":"auto","background-attachment":"scroll","background-type":"","background-media":"","overlay-type":"","overlay-color":"","overlay-opacity":"","overlay-gradient":""},"mobile":{"background-color":"","background-image":"","background-repeat":"repeat","background-position":"center center","background-size":"auto","background-attachment":"scroll","background-type":"","background-media":"","overlay-type":"","overlay-color":"","overlay-opacity":"","overlay-gradient":""}},"ast-content-background-meta":{"desktop":{"background-color":"var(--ast-global-color-4)","background-image":"","background-repeat":"repeat","background-position":"center center","background-size":"auto","background-attachment":"scroll","background-type":"","background-media":"","overlay-type":"","overlay-color":"","overlay-opacity":"","overlay-gradient":""},"tablet":{"background-color":"var(--ast-global-color-4)","background-image":"","background-repeat":"repeat","background-position":"center center","background-size":"auto","background-attachment":"scroll","background-type":"","background-media":"","overlay-type":"","overlay-color":"","overlay-opacity":"","overlay-gradient":""},"mobile":{"background-color":"var(--ast-global-color-4)","background-image":"","background-repeat":"repeat","background-position":"center center","background-size":"auto","background-attachment":"scroll","background-type":"","background-media":"","overlay-type":"","overlay-color":"","overlay-opacity":"","overlay-gradient":""}},"footnotes":""},"categories":[11],"tags":[],"class_list":["post-3054","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","hentry","category-liturgi"],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/aomoi.net\/blogg\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/3054","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/aomoi.net\/blogg\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/aomoi.net\/blogg\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/aomoi.net\/blogg\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/2"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/aomoi.net\/blogg\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=3054"}],"version-history":[{"count":1,"href":"https:\/\/aomoi.net\/blogg\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/3054\/revisions"}],"predecessor-version":[{"id":5639,"href":"https:\/\/aomoi.net\/blogg\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/3054\/revisions\/5639"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/aomoi.net\/blogg\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=3054"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/aomoi.net\/blogg\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=3054"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/aomoi.net\/blogg\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=3054"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}