{"id":3831,"date":"2009-01-13T11:42:00","date_gmt":"2009-01-13T10:42:00","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/aomoi.net\/blog\/arkiv\/1644"},"modified":"2012-02-13T11:25:38","modified_gmt":"2012-02-13T10:25:38","slug":"b%c3%b8r-en-prest-f%c3%b8lge-noen-av-de-tradisjonelle-rubrikkene-nar-han-feirer-messen","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/aomoi.net\/blogg\/2009\/01\/b%c3%b8r-en-prest-f%c3%b8lge-noen-av-de-tradisjonelle-rubrikkene-nar-han-feirer-messen\/","title":{"rendered":"B\u00f8r en prest f\u00f8lge (noen av) de tradisjonelle rubrikkene n\u00e5r han feirer messen?"},"content":{"rendered":"<p>Jeg vet at en av prestene i v\u00e5rt bisped\u00f8mme (jeg skal ikke nevne hans navn her) holder tommel og pekefinger sammen etter konsekrasjonen (til han vasker fingrene etter kommunion), b\u00e6rer biretta inn og ut av kirken &#8211; og sikkert ogs\u00e5 f\u00f8lger mange av de gamle rubrikkene i (alle) sine messer. Selv gjennomf\u00f8rer jeg dette med fingrene til en viss grad, men har funnet det vanskelig \u00e5 gjennomf\u00f8re konsekvent i den &laquo;nye&raquo; messen. Men jeg har tatt opp mange andre elementer fra de gamle rubrikkene, om hvordan presten holder hendene, b\u00f8yer hodet etc, og syns at dette beriker messefeiringa og hjelper meg \u00e5 holde fokus.<\/p>\n<p><a href=\"http:\/\/wdtprs.com\/blog\/2009\/01\/a-ray-of-hope\/\">Father Z. tok opp dette p\u00e5 sin blog i g\u00e5r<\/a>; og siterer en prest som skriver slik:<br \/>\n<i><font color=\"#333399\">&laquo;A reader recently sent in that he\/she noticed the priest purifying his hands after the distribution of Holy Communion.  I had started doing this some time ago, maybe a year?  It was something I saw a few bishops doing at the College Seminary I attended.  The reader asked if it was in the near future that the priest might begin to hold his thumb and forefinger together after the Consecration.  Well, it took some practice to be able to life the chalice, how to flip pages and such; but I started to do this at private Masses that I said.  It got to the point where it was habitual to do just that, and now it is a regular part of my celebration of the Holy Eucharist.  To me, it is a constant reminder of what I am doing as I celebrate.&raquo;<\/font><\/i><\/p>\n<p>I kommentarene stiller man sp\u00f8rsm\u00e5l om man kan bruke disse rubrikkene som tilh\u00f8rer messens gamle form (der den nye messeformens rubrikker ikke sier noe), og en person skriver slik:<\/p>\n<p><i><font color=\"#333399\">The thing about the Novus Ordo is that it gives almost no direction to priests on matters such as how or where his hands are to be help. For example, the rubrics say nothing about <\/font><\/i><!--more--> <i><font color=\"#333399\">where a priest is to place his right hand when his left is employed and vice versa or what to do with his thumbs and forefingers after the consecration (in the Gregorian Rite all these minute details are specified). Failing to have direction, it can\u2019t be wrong, according to a strict reading of the rubrics, to do them one way or the other. One might say, though, that applying a hermeneutic of continuity would lead us to interpret that the old rule would still stand, being not contradicted in the new rubrics. There really is no such thing as \u201cgoing beyond\u201d the rubrics. What is it that you really mean by this? With regards to rubrics you can really only follow them or violate them. If the rubrics do not address a matter I don\u2019t see how you can be in violation of them. Where there is no rubric we are left to the celebrant\u2019s discretion according to taste and custom, both of which seem to me to call for the old practice\u2019s conservation. This is the case regarding the celebrant\u2019s thumbs and forefingers following the consecrations. It absolutely does not violate any rubric to preserve the more ancient practice.<\/font><\/i><\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Jeg vet at en av prestene i v\u00e5rt bisped\u00f8mme (jeg skal ikke nevne hans navn her) holder tommel og pekefinger sammen etter konsekrasjonen (til han vasker fingrene etter kommunion), b\u00e6rer biretta inn og ut av kirken &#8211; og sikkert ogs\u00e5 f\u00f8lger mange av de gamle rubrikkene i (alle) sine messer. Selv gjennomf\u00f8rer jeg dette med [&hellip;]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":2,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"site-sidebar-layout":"default","site-content-layout":"","ast-site-content-layout":"default","site-content-style":"default","site-sidebar-style":"default","ast-global-header-display":"","ast-banner-title-visibility":"","ast-main-header-display":"","ast-hfb-above-header-display":"","ast-hfb-below-header-display":"","ast-hfb-mobile-header-display":"","site-post-title":"","ast-breadcrumbs-content":"","ast-featured-img":"","footer-sml-layout":"","ast-disable-related-posts":"","theme-transparent-header-meta":"","adv-header-id-meta":"","stick-header-meta":"","header-above-stick-meta":"","header-main-stick-meta":"","header-below-stick-meta":"","astra-migrate-meta-layouts":"default","ast-page-background-enabled":"default","ast-page-background-meta":{"desktop":{"background-color":"var(--ast-global-color-5)","background-image":"","background-repeat":"repeat","background-position":"center center","background-size":"auto","background-attachment":"scroll","background-type":"","background-media":"","overlay-type":"","overlay-color":"","overlay-opacity":"","overlay-gradient":""},"tablet":{"background-color":"","background-image":"","background-repeat":"repeat","background-position":"center center","background-size":"auto","background-attachment":"scroll","background-type":"","background-media":"","overlay-type":"","overlay-color":"","overlay-opacity":"","overlay-gradient":""},"mobile":{"background-color":"","background-image":"","background-repeat":"repeat","background-position":"center center","background-size":"auto","background-attachment":"scroll","background-type":"","background-media":"","overlay-type":"","overlay-color":"","overlay-opacity":"","overlay-gradient":""}},"ast-content-background-meta":{"desktop":{"background-color":"var(--ast-global-color-4)","background-image":"","background-repeat":"repeat","background-position":"center center","background-size":"auto","background-attachment":"scroll","background-type":"","background-media":"","overlay-type":"","overlay-color":"","overlay-opacity":"","overlay-gradient":""},"tablet":{"background-color":"var(--ast-global-color-4)","background-image":"","background-repeat":"repeat","background-position":"center center","background-size":"auto","background-attachment":"scroll","background-type":"","background-media":"","overlay-type":"","overlay-color":"","overlay-opacity":"","overlay-gradient":""},"mobile":{"background-color":"var(--ast-global-color-4)","background-image":"","background-repeat":"repeat","background-position":"center center","background-size":"auto","background-attachment":"scroll","background-type":"","background-media":"","overlay-type":"","overlay-color":"","overlay-opacity":"","overlay-gradient":""}},"footnotes":""},"categories":[11,12],"tags":[],"class_list":["post-3831","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","hentry","category-liturgi","category-tlm"],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/aomoi.net\/blogg\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/3831","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/aomoi.net\/blogg\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/aomoi.net\/blogg\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/aomoi.net\/blogg\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/2"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/aomoi.net\/blogg\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=3831"}],"version-history":[{"count":2,"href":"https:\/\/aomoi.net\/blogg\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/3831\/revisions"}],"predecessor-version":[{"id":5358,"href":"https:\/\/aomoi.net\/blogg\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/3831\/revisions\/5358"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/aomoi.net\/blogg\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=3831"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/aomoi.net\/blogg\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=3831"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/aomoi.net\/blogg\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=3831"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}