{"id":8488,"date":"2013-05-24T08:45:29","date_gmt":"2013-05-24T06:45:29","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/aomoi.net\/blogg\/?p=8488"},"modified":"2013-05-24T13:55:50","modified_gmt":"2013-05-24T11:55:50","slug":"om-messefeiringen-vende-seg-mot-folket-eller-mot-gud","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/aomoi.net\/blogg\/2013\/05\/om-messefeiringen-vende-seg-mot-folket-eller-mot-gud\/","title":{"rendered":"Om messefeiringen – vende seg mot folket eller mot Gud"},"content":{"rendered":"

I en diskusjon om den nye engelske oversettelsen av messen leser jeg p\u00e5 bloggen The Deacon’s Bench<\/a> hva en prest nylig opplevde og hans reaksjoner p\u00e5 dette:<\/p>\n

I concelebrated at a Funeral Mass with an older priest (about 75) about four months after the new Missal came into use. I was the main celebrant. His parts were reading the Gospel and the sections of the Eucharistic Prayer given to concelebrants.<\/p>\n

He did this with real difficulty, the reason being that he kept trying to look at the congregation as he read. This is much easier with the older, easily memorized text. This book keeps you needing to read from it.<\/p>\n

Most priests do not seem to ever have thought about the nature of ritual at all. The priest who comes out on the altar and greets the folks in his own colloquial way, and then starts the Mass with the text, doesn\u2019t ealize that there IS a greeting in the Mass. He speaks in \u201creal life\u201d and then retreats to the formal worship. He does so at the end as well. \u201cHave a nice day!\u201d<\/p>\n

This priest I concelebrated with did not seem to realize that in the Eucharistic Prayer we are speaking to God, not the congregation.<\/p>\n

I believe that putting the priest celebrant behind the altar facing the people was a very serious, core error. When I celebrate the Traditional Mass or the Anglican Use liturgy (which is generally celebrated with the traditional altar ceremonies), I come before the altar, face it in the same direction as the people, and begin Mass by addressing Him. I submit myself to the rite; the people submit themselves to the rite. We participate together.<\/p>\n

The Novus Ordo has made the priest the focus. He starts by initiating a dialogue with the people. He keeps up this dialogue throughout the Mass. He stands behind the Altar like Julia Childs doing a cooking demonstration at her kitchen island.<\/p>\n

Subtly but pervasively this has changed our whole approach to worship. …. <\/p><\/blockquote>\n

Jeg syns ogs\u00e5 det er ganske \u00f8deleggende om presten ser p\u00e5 folket sv\u00e6rt mye mens han ber til Gud, og det har jeg nevnt flere ganger tidligere. Det er mulig \u00e5 holde fokus rett sted selv om alteret er vendt mot folket, men alter vendt den tradisjonelle veien syns jeg fungerer ganske mye bedre.<\/p>\n

Jeg leste dette f\u00f8rst hos Father Z<\/a>, og p\u00e5 hans blogg er det en interessant kommentar fra en prest:<\/p>\n

Since I have been a bit under the weather for the past week and a half, I have watched some TV. It gave me the chance to watch the Mass on television, since I wasn\u2019t even able to say the Mass. There was a very good, very traditional priest at one of the Masses, but he had that same attitude. Throughout, he had to look up at the people. …. this looking up at the congregation during the prayers and every prayer ending, as if \u201che\u201d needed the people\u2019s consent. No, they give their assent to God in the Amen.<\/p><\/blockquote>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"

I en diskusjon om den nye engelske oversettelsen av messen leser jeg p\u00e5 bloggen The Deacon’s Bench hva en prest nylig opplevde og hans reaksjoner p\u00e5 dette: I concelebrated at a Funeral Mass with an older priest (about 75) about four months after the new Missal came into use. I was the main celebrant. His […]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":2,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"site-sidebar-layout":"default","site-content-layout":"","ast-site-content-layout":"default","site-content-style":"default","site-sidebar-style":"default","ast-global-header-display":"","ast-banner-title-visibility":"","ast-main-header-display":"","ast-hfb-above-header-display":"","ast-hfb-below-header-display":"","ast-hfb-mobile-header-display":"","site-post-title":"","ast-breadcrumbs-content":"","ast-featured-img":"","footer-sml-layout":"","ast-disable-related-posts":"","theme-transparent-header-meta":"","adv-header-id-meta":"","stick-header-meta":"","header-above-stick-meta":"","header-main-stick-meta":"","header-below-stick-meta":"","astra-migrate-meta-layouts":"default","ast-page-background-enabled":"default","ast-page-background-meta":{"desktop":{"background-color":"var(--ast-global-color-5)","background-image":"","background-repeat":"repeat","background-position":"center center","background-size":"auto","background-attachment":"scroll","background-type":"","background-media":"","overlay-type":"","overlay-color":"","overlay-opacity":"","overlay-gradient":""},"tablet":{"background-color":"","background-image":"","background-repeat":"repeat","background-position":"center center","background-size":"auto","background-attachment":"scroll","background-type":"","background-media":"","overlay-type":"","overlay-color":"","overlay-opacity":"","overlay-gradient":""},"mobile":{"background-color":"","background-image":"","background-repeat":"repeat","background-position":"center center","background-size":"auto","background-attachment":"scroll","background-type":"","background-media":"","overlay-type":"","overlay-color":"","overlay-opacity":"","overlay-gradient":""}},"ast-content-background-meta":{"desktop":{"background-color":"var(--ast-global-color-4)","background-image":"","background-repeat":"repeat","background-position":"center center","background-size":"auto","background-attachment":"scroll","background-type":"","background-media":"","overlay-type":"","overlay-color":"","overlay-opacity":"","overlay-gradient":""},"tablet":{"background-color":"var(--ast-global-color-4)","background-image":"","background-repeat":"repeat","background-position":"center center","background-size":"auto","background-attachment":"scroll","background-type":"","background-media":"","overlay-type":"","overlay-color":"","overlay-opacity":"","overlay-gradient":""},"mobile":{"background-color":"var(--ast-global-color-4)","background-image":"","background-repeat":"repeat","background-position":"center center","background-size":"auto","background-attachment":"scroll","background-type":"","background-media":"","overlay-type":"","overlay-color":"","overlay-opacity":"","overlay-gradient":""}},"footnotes":""},"categories":[11],"tags":[],"class_list":["post-8488","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","hentry","category-liturgi"],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/aomoi.net\/blogg\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/8488","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/aomoi.net\/blogg\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/aomoi.net\/blogg\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/aomoi.net\/blogg\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/2"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/aomoi.net\/blogg\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=8488"}],"version-history":[{"count":2,"href":"https:\/\/aomoi.net\/blogg\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/8488\/revisions"}],"predecessor-version":[{"id":8493,"href":"https:\/\/aomoi.net\/blogg\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/8488\/revisions\/8493"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/aomoi.net\/blogg\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=8488"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/aomoi.net\/blogg\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=8488"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/aomoi.net\/blogg\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=8488"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}